I read the responses to my first rant, some which seemed to agree and others which disagreed. But I just simply had to make some points regarding the responses I got which either disagreed or that said I was making too big of an issue out of it.
First off, I think that you guys misunderstand the overall importance of media coverage. You guys can say, "I would rather be the underdogs and sneak up on people" or "who really cares what the national media says anyway" all you want, and I truly understand where you are coming from. Problem is, you guys are really missing just what national media coverage brings to a team.
Underdogs and Cinderella stories are terrific, it's always fun to be David slaying Goliath, but the fact of the matter is, Goliath wins that matchup 99 times out of 100 and Cinderella is a fairy tale.
National exposure brings several things to a team that you guys seem to be overlooking; firstly, national recognition brings respect, and a fear, to those teams we face.
Back in the day when there were dynasties, before parity, there were teams who got all kinds of national exposure, who honestly had the game won before they even stepped out onto the field. The other teams didn't really believe that they had a chance against them, and so for them the battle was already lost.
The mental game is just as important as the physical game, and when teams line up against the Patriots or the Eagles or the Falcons or the Colts, they fear them. Even if they think they can beat them, they fear them. And a large amount of that fear comes from the media telling them week after week after week just how good these teams are. Granted in this parity driven league this is not the factor that it used to be in the days of dynasties, but it is still a big part.
With exposure comes respect, and with respect comes fear, and fear paralyzes.
More importantly however, is the fact that exposure, brings talent. Talented players WANT to go play for teams that have respect and have national exposure. They DON'T want to play in Egypt where they get no exposure. The really great players WANT to see themselves on ESPN, they WANT to be talked about and debated about in the media.
Can I prove that statement? YES! The proof is in the fact that every single year, free agents go to teams where the national exposure is high, and where they have a chance to win. The players themselves all talk about respect until everyone is sick of hearing it. The players themselves are constantly talking about how their particular team didn't get any respect. What do they mean by respect? MEDIA ATTENTION!!! Todays players equate respect with national exposure, plain and simple, and teams that get no national exposure, get no respect, and therefore don't get the big name, big time, game changing athletes.
Why is it that every single year, teams like the Cardinals, and the Saints, or whatever other perenially crappy team you can think of, ALWAYS draft high and can never seem to assemble a talented team? Are these teams really so inept in the draft that they simply do not know talent? Or is that, due to lack of national exposure, as soon as these players contracts run out, they bolt for bigger and better things? If you are honest, you know the answer to that question.
A few years back for example, the Cardinals drafted Simean Rice, a very gifted athlete, who floundered in mediocrity in Arizona, uuntil when finally his contract ran out, he bolted to the team which at that time was getting all the media hype, the Buccaneers. Suddenly Simean Rice seemed to become overnight a great DE. Was it really that all of a sudden he just got better? Or was it that reallly he had been great all along but now suddenly the media began talking about it? Again if you are being honest you know the answer to that question.
The Bengals who were called the Bungles for so many years, couldn't ever seem to get it together, until they hired a coach who was a media darling. Suddenly, almost magically good players decided they wanted to go play in Cincinatti. Coincidence? Nope, simply the power of media exposure. After all, who wanted to go play for a team who nobody respected? But now the media was paying attention after this big hiring, and voila; players said for the first time in almost 20 years, gee maybe I will think about going to play for the Bengals.
When is the last time that you heard a player talk about how he would just love to go play in Seattle? That's right, it never happens. But I bet it would if the media was talking about what a great team we had all the time, like they do with the Eagles.
Bottom line is, if you think that players don't care about exposure you are flat out stupid or insane. Exposure drives up the price of their contracts, exposure makes a good player like Derek Jeter, (and that's what he is, a good player NOT a great player) into a hero of legendary proportions, bigger than life. Jeter is a sure fire hall of famer, but when you look at his actual numbers, there is no way he belongs there. So why will he get in? Because he has become bigger than his numbers, because of the national media.
If you were a great football player who had been drafted by some crappy team like the Saints and your contract ran out, where would you go? If you said that you would resign with the Saints you are a liar of epic proportions! If you said Seattle, you need to seek therapy for being a pathological liar. You would go to the place where you had the best chance of winning, and got the most face time. You would go to the place that gave you the best chance of becoming a household name, of cashing in the biggest paycheck and becoming a legend.
Remember when Eli Manning got drafted by the Chargers and he didn't want to play ther? Do you think that was because he doesn't like beautiful sunny days and warm weather? Do you think that he preferred playing in New York because he likes high crime and hot dogs? He preferred to play in New York because he thought that over the long haul he had a better chance to make his career into something legendary in New York. Because of the team assembled there? Hell no, everyone knew that the Chargers had the better team. NATIONAL EXPOSURE is the answer, period end of story!
He knows, like everyone who is being honest with themselves knows, that the Giants, whether they have ups or downs, will always be able to aquire talent, and will always be able to eventually come out of their slumps. Why? Because of the media exposure. Players will always want to play in New York, because they know beforehand that they have a chance to go beyond being thought of as a good player, they can be thought of as a legend.
Think I am wrong? Well try this on for size, two hall of fame baseball players, one playing on the east coast with that huge media machine, one playing in San Diego. The players numbers in San Diego over his career are simply breathtaking and far better than the numbers from the player on the east coast. Yet the player from the east coast is revered at a level very disproportionate to his numbers, while the player from San Diego is lagrely forgotten about outside of people who remember seeing him play and really followed the sport, or outside of San Diego. Of course you have guessed by now that I am talking about Cal Ripken Jr. and Tony Gwynn. Cal is a hero on par with Ted Williams, while Gwynn is only remembered as a very good hitter. Yet Gwynn was at the very least every bit as good a player, and if you look at the numbers, was actually a FAR better player hands down. So what was the difference? National exposure!
Last point, then I am done. Why do you guys all say that you enjoy being the underdog? I for one don't get it. Underdog just means loveable loser. Me personally I would rather be the heavy favorite, the team that every team is scared spitless of facing, the team that everybody knows has a great chance to win it all every year.
I would much rather be the Yankees than the Cubs, or the Lakers, than the Cavaliers. HELLOOOOOO! Being the Cinderella or the underdog sneaking up on people just means that usually you SUCK!!! But hey if guys like being thought of as losers, well...I guess there's no accounting for taste. Me personally, I would rather be thought of as the baddest boy on the block, the one guy who everyone points to and says, you don't even want to mess with him, rather than "Don't even give me the Seahawks, they are a joke."
Wow! Two homeruns two days in a row! Monkey's on a roll!
ReplyDeleteI definitely agree with what you said about players wanting to come and play for a team with 'National' exposure. We discussed this several times in teh off-season, feeling some marquee players have spurned teh Hawks due in large part to the l;ack of National media coverage.
Posted by Vinnyhawkalugi
I agree with both of those sentiments, and would add one more thing, arguably the most valuable player on the team might be leaving the team, not just because of monetary incentives, but because he feels he's not getting the recognition and media exposure he deserves.
ReplyDeleteBut that being said, I think things are starting to change, I do feel like people are respecting the Hawks more, and our "bandwagon" will continue to fill up as the season goes on.
Posted by PaulieP
National Attention = $$$
ReplyDeleteIn terms of ticket sales, product sales, endorsement deals, and after-football careers.
Also, respect and attention from the national media equates to getting more nationally televised games. Why is it that the Seahawks get one MNF game if they're lucky, when teams like the Colts, Eagles and Atlant get several EVERY year?
Granted some of that has to do with market size and TV ratings, but mostly it has to do with teams that get talked about.
Posted by alba
Exactly alba, exactly.
ReplyDeleteAlexander, teh Hawks MVP? Man I hope not, if so we're in trouble.
ReplyDelete'Cause he' probably gone next season.
Posted by Vinnyhawkalugi
It also has to do with record, the Colts, and Eagles have had very good records, and multiple wins in the post season lately, and the Falcons have Michael Vick (a marketers dream ((especially Valtrex))). I don't disagree with you, but I will say that we were set to have 2 Monday night games, and one Sunday night game this year. (Huge mess up by the league, I believe the Hawks/Rams game was supposed to be a MNF, but there was some hesitance over the Mariners post season hopes)
ReplyDeletePosted by PaulieP
For this team to be successful in the long run we need the MVP to be Matt. (it's all about the QB)
ReplyDeleteFor this team to be successful in the long run we need the MVP to be Matt. (it's all about the QB)
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ReplyDeleteAwww Crap! I hate when I do that! Well ya get my point anyway. :)
ReplyDeleteIt also has to do with record, the Colts, and Eagles have had very good records, and multiple wins in the post season lately, and the Falcons have Michael Vick (a marketers dream ((especially Valtrex))). I don't disagree with you, but I will say that we were set to have 2 Monday night games, and one Sunday night game this year. (Huge mess up by the league, I believe the Hawks/Rams game was supposed to be a MNF, but there was some hesitance over the Mariners post season hopes)
ReplyDeleteIn fact, I'm going to take it a step further and say that it has nothing to do with "teams that get talked about" and everything to do with Money. The NFL doesn't have popularity as an end goal, but it is a means to their end goal, Making Money. More people are interested in whether McNabb and Owens can interact with each other and what incredible play Vick will pull off than whether Jones will stuff another D-End or Shaun will break the franchise record. Popularity factors in, but lets face it, even if you don't like the Eagles, you were watching the MNF game against the Falcons, if only for the above mentioned reasons.
Posted by PaulieP
Not necessarily Vin, I wouldn't say Dilfer was the MVP of that Baltimore team.
ReplyDeleteEvery team is built differently, and with the numbers he's put up, along with his improvement in needed areas (blocking), Shaun is definitely our MVP
Posted by PaulieP
I agree Paulie, but the only reason that anyone cares whether or not T.O. and McNabb can get along is because the media has hyped the thing to death. No one would give a rats behind, in fact no one would even know about the fact that there were problems except that the national media (especially ESPN) talked about it every single day for months.
ReplyDeleteNo doubt, Vick is a marketers dream, so he is the real reason for the media exposure in Atlanta, I don't disagree. I also agree that the bottom line as you mentioned is $$$, BUT the media creates the market that brings in the money.
Vick is a lousy QB but a fantastic athlete who is the kind of guy who the media thinks is interesting. So they talk about him all the time, and then the sheeple out there become interested and buy his jersey. It's not like there were tons of Falcons fans and Falcons jerseys out there, at least not until the media overhyped Vick to the point where it gives me gas.
I get your point, and in a way we are arguing the chicken or the egg, but in my opinion it is the media that creats the interest and the market.
If the media made a huge deal out of Hasselbeck or Alexander all the time don't you think that poeple would really begin to notice and start demanding even more exposure? I do. The Eagles "story" isn't really a story at all except that the media turned it into one. The media decided the story was interesting (I very much disagree, it couldn't be any less interesting to me) and so puffed the piece so that now people care about whether or not those two meat heads get along.
The media puffed the Lakers to the point that they were the story all year last year, even when they sucked, and even when they really weren't a story because Shaq had already gone to Miami. And yet ESPN talked about the Lakers constantly.
Would anyone outside of Boston and New York care about the whole Red Sox Yankees rivalry if it weren't for the media constantly hyping it? No, I don't give a rats ass about it now. It would be just another rivalry like the Dodgers Giants if it weren't for the media.
I guess my point is that it is the media that decides what is interesting and sellable, so it is the media that drives the market. Not so much the market driving the media.
I guess I see it the other way, but you're exactly right with the chicken/egg thing.
ReplyDeletePosted by PaulieP
But that's not to say I totally disagree with you, I do think that the stars in Seattle (Shaun, Matt, Lofa, our entire secondary ((with Hamlin healthy))) deserve a ton more exposure than they're getting. Last night, I made a comment that relates, saying that if/when Hamlin comes back, he better get the hype that Bruschi is getting. But we all know he won't.
ReplyDeletePosted by PaulieP
To the defense of the east coast bias, if the Seahawks had won 3 of the last 4 superbowls, then YES, Hamlin would get Bruschi like coverage upon his return.
ReplyDeleteAnd Vin, check out the new masthead at Seahawks.com and you'll see you're probably right!
Posted by alba
monkey nailed it again!
ReplyDeleteand I have to say...the fact you named Tony Gwynn makes me happy...he was and is my 2nd favorite baseball player of all time (when asked his secret to hitting...how well does he see the pitch...he responded saying, i dont care about the pitch, i just swing)...behind Griffey of course (sorry biter Mariner fans)
anyways...monkey brought some new points...his last one intrigued me...
the influence
I have no idea if anyone read my ridiculously long rant in the other topic, so ill shorten it here...
The media choses favorites...exposes them way too much these days, and the mindless zombies that are humans in America eat it up, becuase thats all they are exposed too...the cycle continues because when they are exposed, they get attached...and when attached, the media sees the addiction, so they play it out even more...
the Owens McNabb saga...exposed to the nation...the nation starts talking about it since its the only thing going on...the media sees them talking about it...so they expose it even more
its a screwed up cycle that will always be there, but the fact remains, there needs to be more equality in the exposure..i can understand playoff teams getting a little more (not us or Denver, though Denver is starting to get noticed after killing the team i said was overrated for the last 3 years)...and Super Bowl teams can get a little more...
but this is ridiculous and completely uneven
it shouldnt be Philly 60% (literally), New England 20%...GB, Dallas, Eli Manning 2%...everyone else gets .1% (just examples)
thats why when you see polls...like
ReplyDeleteBest team in the NFC?
Seattle 2%
Philly 65%
Tampa Bay 8% (before Grieses injury)
Dallas 20%
Washington 5%
you see how the votes would go? Anyone notice its from most media attention to least media attention?
I would bet ANYONE on this planet that 95% of the people in this nation dont even follow the whole sport outside their team and the media...the media sways it
Players dont have time to study every team in the NFL...so they have to assume...and therefore they dont wanna go to a place like Seattle over Philly (despite the fact we are BETTER and will prove it to the world on MNF)
monkeys points are perfect...i just expanded a little...its all a cycle, and if the cycle doesnt stop soon...the rich will get richer and the poor will get poorer
Here's another way that media attention helps a team, which is building fan base.
ReplyDeleteSince the NFL has expanded well beyond just rooting for your home team (note the number of contributors NOT from Washington state) the more attention and national exposure your team gets, the more likely that team is of picking up some fringe fans and building its fan base.
Posted by alba
"Me personally, I would rather be thought of as the baddest boy on the block "
ReplyDeleteHow the F are you a Seahawks fan? That line just stunned me. How can you be a fan of the team that defines underdog (lovable losers)? I agree, it would be better to be a team that is feared, but we ain't, and never have been. Oh, and the bay area teams have been known to get some national media... not sure if that is cuz they are in California, or they have in the past usually had winning records.
Posted by JoSCh
joSCH I was waiting for someone to say that. I figured you would be the one to point it out. It's true that the Hawks have always been underdogs, and that in some wierd way I have even taken pride in that.
ReplyDeleteThe thing is, I am a 35 year old guy who has spent a lifetime rooting for a team which is a perrenial underdog, and have come to realize that...IT SUCKS NEVER BEING THE BIG DOG!!!
Fine we have had our years of being the endearing loveable losers, but I am tired of losing and now it's time to win damn it! It's time to be the team to be feared. Yes I fell in love with this team of loveable losers, but I always hoped (and even kinda believed) that someday we would become the bad ass Seahawks. Isn't that why you play? Isn't the point to become as good as you can for as long as you can?
I guess the older I get, the more I realize that being the loveable loser, just means that you are a loser. The older I get the more I realize that it's not about style it's about substance, it's about winning. As I see my time on this planet tick away, I get more desperate for accomplishing those things I want to accomplish in my own personal life, and I am feeling that same way toward my beloved Seahawks.
Besides, we haven't always been pathetic, I have never cheered harder in my life than when the Seahawks were a damn good team back in the 80s, with Dave Krieg and Co. We were a team to be reckoned with back then though we never got over the final hurdle, (came damn close a few times though) and I miss those days when people said "watch out for Seattle, they're a damn good football team."
Yeah, I feel your pain, and I suppose this year is better than most to rail for respect... there are so many great quotes in that response, but my absolute favorite is "Besides, we haven't always been pathetic ", that really is kinda our battle cry, but I think that your (our) time is coming when you'll hear "watch out for Seattle, they're a damn good football team", but it may not be this year regardless. Which is fine, but if/when we do the deed, I agree, we better be top of all the nationwide power rankings week one.
ReplyDeletePosted by JoSCh
Monkey - you hit the nail squarely on the head with that last post. That sums up the life of a Seahawks fan if you've been following the team from day one, or since last year.
ReplyDeleteHow do you go from Lovable Loser to the Superbowl?
It's a combination of Front Office, Head Coach and the right mix of Players. (not to mention a little bit of luck with injuries and close calls!)
Look at the Neveau Champions of recent memory, Patriots, Ravens, Lambs.
The Patriots were like the Seahawks for most of the 70s and 80s, until Bob Kraft took over the team and brought in a guy name Belicheck. Add to that the good fortune of a 4th round QB stepping up to play WAY ABOVE expectation, and you have the most recent "dynasty" team.
The erstwhile Cleveland Browns were cursed by a guy named Elway forever it seemed. Then Modell moved them to Baltimore, brought in a guy named Billick, and built one of the best defenses in the modern era.
The Rams were perennial doormats for what seems like forever. Enter a guy named Vermeil, a great FA pickup in a guy name Marshall, and a bag-boy turned MVP in Kurt Warner, and you've got the Greatest Show on Turf.
The point of this being is that I feel we're CLOSER THAN WE'VE EVER BEEN to becoming that BIG DOG everyone wants us to be.
Seven years ago, everyone thought that just by adding Holmy we'd get over the hump. However, the team was so old and hamstrung by the salary cap, that we weren't going anywhere just by adding a great coach.
Add to that the fact that Holmy was in over his head with the Triple-Crown of Coach, President and GM, and the fact that the front office was as clueless and crazy as a Rams fan in a round room being told to stand in the corner.
Last year it seemed that we were finally turning the corner, but the injury bug hit hard which just seemed to magnify the fracture in the lockerroom and the disfunctional nature of the front office.
Now, with most of the bad apples cleared out, a new President/GM at the helm, it's almost like we got ourselves a new coach, even though it's Holmy still parading the sidelines, and we're finally reaping the benefits of the difference a good coach, dedicated front office, and correct mix of players can provide.
THIS IS OUR YEAR DAMMIT - - - EVERYONE ELSE GET THE FiretrUCK OUT OF THE WAY!
Posted by alba
just wanna add some credit to Jeremy Stevens...he is one of the best examples, of 'what could of been' i can remember when paired with Koren.
ReplyDeleteBoth are going in bad directions...KRob fell lower, Stevens, climbed outta it...now Stevens is out producing him at a position that gets less chances
btw...the rams round table comment is masthead worthy!...
Posted by adp